Are there any Mexico vets on this board?

[Catalina Kids]

I was just wondering if American products were available at the mercado, such as bottled water? Can you get Dasani water down there? Coca Cola etc. We're leaving in November and Patti is starting to freak out about feeding us. Well, not quite that bad but a Catalina 38 doesn't exactly have a lot of storage space. I figure we can shop just as well down there as in the states. We need to devote a lot of our space to spares, diving gear, and sailing gear etc.

We don't drink the water here, I don't think I'll start drinking city water down there. I know putting in a watermaker is a good option but that may have to wait. We can stuff 80 16.9 oz Dasanis in one cubby hole in our boat. We carry 40 gallons in our tanks but I don't drink that either.

[Jan]

Not 100% sure of the availability of bottled water & pretty sure it might not always be Dasani! We didn't find much on the Mexican Yucatan coast, but that was mostly because we didn't hang out in cities. We have friends that spent 3 years in the Sea of Cortez & Mexico Pacific Coast. They say a watermaker is an absolute MUST. It's our experience that boats without watermakers are always having to head back to civilization to fill the tanks while we're staying an extra week or two out in paradise.

Seriously, I'd re-examine the question of a watermaker. Bottled water will be available, but not everywhere. And keep in mind, it's HOT -- our experience is that we drank alot more water than we ever did before we went cruising. We took 3 of the largest containers of powdered gatorade & drank alot of that too -- put it in the water bottles nightly. We kept about 12 water bottles and kept refilling them to put in the fridge.

I know it's another expense, but the Seagull water purifier made our tank water drinkable. I would never drink our tank water before the Seagull & now it tastes better than alot of the bottled water we buy. So if you don't want to get a watermaker before you head to Mexico, think about splurging for a Seagull (they're expensive too, but the best) so you can drink your tank water as well as the bottled water you carry.

Also, don't know where you're planning to head, but if you venture northward from LaPaz, up toward Loreto & Puerto Escondido, you'll find a wonderful cruising ground!

Enjoy! Jan

[Rick Beddoe]

Great info Jan.

What model of Seagull do you use?

[Jan]

http://www.generalecology.com/marinesystem.htm

Ours is the top model, the Seagull IV, I think.

Expensive -- but based on our limited experience, if you plan to cruise for more than about a month at a time, you need to be able to live on your boat as close to the creature comforts of home as possible. Being able to turn on the faucet & make coffee, refill water bottles for the fridge, etc is one of those comforts for us. Keep in mind tho', the water in our tanks is our own watermaker water, never shore-filled, so maybe that contributes to the water quality?

Having to do laundry in a bucket & a daily shower from a sun-shower is about as close to giving up my creature comforts as I'm up for! :) Of course, we don't use A/C at home so we don't miss it except when we're stuck in a marina, which is as infrequently as we can make it!

[Jan]

Before we left last winter, I freaked out about what we were going to eat & tried to stock up on everything we'd eat normally. As we cruised, we found that a BIG part of the fun was trying new stuff & shopping locally. It's important to look at it as part of the adventure tho' because some of what you try, you'll HATE and some you may like better than what you have at home! We have several things we MISS now that we're back in the States for hurricane season!

When we head back to the boat in late October, we won't take much in the way of foodstuffs. Even the red wine we get in Guatemala -- Chilean -- is good, and loads cheaper than if we stuck with American brands!

My advice ... forget American brands & start experimenting. Try buying just one of something & if you find you like it, go back & buy more! But BE FLEXIBLE! You can't plan to go to the grocery store & simply buy items on a list to adhere to a menu plan. You have to do it in reverse -- oh look, these smoked pork chops look great, oh, they have blah, blah here -- I can make XXXXXXXXXXXXXX!!!! Be flexible & creative!

We always have enough food aboard that we could last a week, probably more without having to supplement it. But it's mainly things like tuna, etc -- stuff that we don't usually touch -- and it makes useful trade items for local fishermen so it doesn't get outdated! When it's been on the boat for a season, I use it to trade & buy more before the next winter season. But we'll buy even our stock foodstuffs locally this year!

[Gerry25]

First about Dasani;

Quote from British Press;
"First, Coca-Cola's new brand of "pure" bottled water, Dasani, was revealed earlier this month to be tap water taken from the mains. Then it emerged that what the firm described as its "highly sophisticated purification process", based on Nasa spacecraft technology, was in fact reverse osmosis used in many modest domestic water purification units."

Second;

A major part of cruising in experience local food. Sadly, globalization is making this harder. You will find Wal-Mart in Mexico. Local water is generally fine, add some bleach and filter through a jug filter. Local chicken in Guatemala is superb. Local meat is equally good once you can work with the usual "machete" cuts.

Thirdly;

If you don't eat local food and build up some resistance to the bugs you will eventually get caught out.

Fair Winds

Gerry

[Catalina Kids]

Thanks Gerry and Jan for your replies.

I picked Dasani because it's what we drink, we like the taste compared to the other bottled waters not because of whatever process was used and it's 5.99 per 24 pack. Any bottled water will do in a pinch. I'm still not drinking the water here :) I was just curious how many of this type of American products were available down there.

We shouldn't have any problem taking to the local food, we already eat tacos or Mexican food 4 nites a week. I think it will be a fun adventure, doing the shopping in new places. The main thing is to convince Patti that we only need to pack the boat with 2 or 3 weeks food and water for the trip down. The longest run will be about 300 miles.

What kind of watermaker do you have Jan? How much space does it take up? I think I can get the Little Wonder or the Pur 40 to fit in this spot I have picked out. I know alot of people think the Pur 40 is not a good choice but I'm cosidering it beacause it uses less amps and can be hand operated if need be.

[Winston Gribb]

Ahh for God's sake. Where do you think you are going....Timbuctu?

Wherever you find people, you will find food. And water. If you are going to go cruising you had better get past the bottled water thing. Any time you eat out you will have a salad... rinsed in local water, dishes washed in local water, ice in your drinks made from local water and all foods cooked...in local water.

The biggest pain in the ass I ever ran into while cruising was a couple in Venezuela (actually only 'she' was the problem)who insisted on buying only bottled water for 'everything'. The poor shmuck of a husband had to cart litterally hundreds of individual gallon jugs of wate to fill their tanks everywhere they went.

Water makers are okay I suppose but what are you going to do when it breaks down?....they always breakdown...everything breaks down. What could be worse than being stuck in the middle of nowhere with and have to drink the local water?...Being stuck in the middle of nowhere and having to drink the local water....without ever having your body built up immunity to the various grades and quality of 'local' water where you have been traveling.

Unless you have some rare disease that requires nothing but the purest of water entering your body, you should break yourself into the acceptance of drinking local water....wherever you go.

[Catalina Kids]

Winston, Winston, Winston, the problem here is you don't know me. I was simply CURIOUS. It is not some queer cruising requirement. I'm a carpenter, I live in dirt, I eat dirt sandwiches, I drink dirty water out of pipes with the pipe dope still soft in the pipes. For 2 years I was a long haul trucker, I have eaten in some of the filthyest places in the United States, I was simply CURIOUS. But now that you mention it, I have MRSA from showering in it. If you want to come to LA and drink the water, be my guest.

[Winston Gribb]

MRSA??? You mean methicillin resistant Staphylococcus aureus ???

And you got it in L.A.?

Sounds more like something you would eat in Alabama.

[Catalina Kids]

LA= Los Angeles, although Lousiana has the most dirty, slimey, stinking truckstops in the nation.

[Rayc]

The Mexican version of Walmart has bottled water but we went for the 5 gal jug and used it to refill bike bottles. If you want a "brand" bottled water look for Fiji, the square bottles store easier!

[Catalina Kids]

Hey Ray, thanks for your reply. That's the kind of info I was looking for.

[brant]

Hi,
I've done l2-l5 years cruising in the Sea of Cortez and west coast of Mexico. I'd be glad to share experiences and opinion. You may e-mail me your phone number and I'll get in touch. brant@suwa.org

[Charlie-Papa]

Seagull are good systems the filter goes down to 0.5 microns nominal and 1.0 micron absolute.
You can find on the market similar performances with drastic lower prices.
A Pentair CBC-10 cartridge will do the same 0.5 it is a carbon block and would cost like 25.00 per replacement. A lot of other mfgr have similar products.
A good practice is to add a little bleach in your tank to prevent bacteria contamination. The chlorine will be removed by the carbon filter unless you over do it.
I am a water treatment specialist and that is what I use. Sometimes like elsewhere the price is not all. Again I do not want to depreciate Seagull products; but you can find equivalent performance. If someone does not mind paying well...........

Charlie-Papa

[LaDonna & Rob]

Of course that was in the 80s but still. As far as the food goes, tell Patty to bring what you really like for treats: Oreos, Triscuits, Reeses, etc. Any and all basics can be found anywhere: flour, sugar, coffee, etc. As someone mentioned, you may find you like Mexican brands of certain things better anyway. Oooh, and the chicken down there is divine! No hormones or any other crap. Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!

One item I wouldn't recommend buying though are Mexican marshmallows. Maybe they've changed but when we were there, they came in different colors and all of them would burst into flame over a beachfire - no browning whatsoever, just immediate combustion!

Water is always an issue. Lugging jerry cans all over hell and back is a real PITA. Plus the self sufficiency of having a watermaker (as long as it doesn't break down) is a real blessing. If there's any way you can swing one, don't hesitate. That said, plenty of folks are still lugging jerry cans so...

Don't know about bottled water but I would have a hunch that they're all just filled from the tap down there. Maybe run through a filter but still. I dont' think Baja has a problem with water though. We never, not once, had an issue with drinking Baja water. My understanding is that the mainland has more "bugs". Personally, I think you'd be better off getting a really high end filtration system for your tanks than drinking Mexican bottled water cuz you really don't know what the source is.

Have fun and feel free to email!

LD

[Catalina Kids]

hey LD, thanks for your tips. Patti will be glad to hear about the chicken. We'll shoot you an e-mail.

Thanks everyone for your responses.

[Catalina Kids]

hey Charlie-Papa, thanks for the water tips. I was wondering how much clorox per 20 gallons water?

[Charlie-Papa]

It all depend on a lot of variables.
Bleach is a chemical that will deteriorate in time. When you read the label and you see: Content 5.25 sodium hypochlorite or whatever, it is the content when packaged. If it was 2 months ago or 9 months ago you do not have the same residual. Heat and exposure to sunlight will accelerate the chlorine loss. Another thing is the quality of the raw water. If you fill it up at a marina where the metal content is appreciable, it will consume the chlorine you added. The very same for bacteria.
An easy way to do it is to buy an inexpensive pooltest kit at any home hardware store.With this you will measure the free chlorine; if you add one or 2 ounces of bleach with x qty of water, once it is all mixed up, measure the residual chlorine left. A reading of + or - 0.5 ppm would be enough to protect you. The higher the better but do not go above 1.0 ppm
Then you have city water on your boat. Will take care of fishy smell if you clean knives used to prepare your catch. Will sterilize kitchen rag even control algea and mushroom in cracks on your kitchen counter.
An inexpensive carbon block water filter will remove any taste residual and deliver near perfect water for pennies. Make sure you kook the filter to a dedicated small faucet. That way you can wash hands and uncertain fruits and vegetables with chlorinated water and do a final rinse with unchlorinated.
If you have a watermaker. You could add an inexpensive home R. O ( reverse osmosis ) take the water from your watermaker storage and produce even better water in a separate tank. The TDS will likely be reduced by 95%. This water could be of enough quality to top your batteries without running around to get distilled water. The pressure from this R.O. could feed the ice maker as well. A small UV stelilizer could provide total bacteria free water. You should consider adding anyway to whatever water system you have a UV lamp. Not that much money and it will kill a lot of fancy bugs.
Ok enough of water 101....

Charlie Papa

[Charlie-Papa]

Oups !!!
that one or 2 ounces is NOT PER 20 GALS TANK it is more for a couple of hundred gals tank. For 20 gals try 5 or 10 or 20 drops... until you have enough.

Charlie Papa

[Jeff C]

LA is the abbreviation for Louisiana.
L.A. is the abbreviation for Los Angeles.

What I can never memorize is MO, MA and MI.

___ ___

Americans (of which I am one) have a long history of almost neurotic obsession with cleanliness (and our ethno-centrism generates jokes about European hygeine). We buy the most (per capita) soap, deodorant, toothpaste, etc., and are extremely self-conscious about people being able to smell anything about us that wasn't a purchased scent. Just count the commercials; it'll make your head spin.

Relaxing a bit and dealing with local conditions is good for the blood pressure. Montezuma's Revenge ravaging my intestines is just the house-warming party; they settle in, you come out the other end (maybe not the best choice of words here) having adapted, and then it's less of a concern. Consider it a rite of passage (don't giggle).

Filtering water for palatability, sure. But distrusting local sources leads to some extreme behavior sometimes.

[bud]

I have been drinking municipal water at Nassau, Trinidad, Puerto La Cruise Venezuela, Cartegena Colombia, and Colon Panama. I put it in my tanks along with my watermaker water. ---- Never had a minutes trouble with tummy problems or bad taste.

Also, all watermakers use the same basic membranes and so no one of them makes water any better than anyone else. The best watermakers are the most simple ones. After all, YOU must keep them running.

Chill out, there are MANY more important things to worry about when cruising than bottled water.

[Catalina Kids]

"Chill out, there are MANY more important things to worry about when cruising than bottled water."

Enlighten me.

[JeanneP]

It's a lot of work to carry enough bottled water to the boat, and then you have to dispose of all those bottles.

On our SV Watermelon we had a regular home filtration system with the finest gauge filter to remove parasites, such as Giardia (this was important in the Caribbean and in SE Asia). We also filtered the water with a simple sediment filter before we put it into the tank - no matter how clear the water looked, we were getting brown-to-mud-colored water at the end of the tank after a few fillings otherwise.

Chlorine treatment of water is not particularly reliable for the removal of Giardia, dysentery, etc.. Iodine is better, 1 micron filter or finer is probably most reliable.

On our MV Watermelon (yeah, yeah, I'm not particularly original) we can't install a house filter system because there's no place to put the separate faucet, so I've been using a Britta filter. The first filter I used was clogged when the indicator showed it still had half its life. So we drained the tank, opened the inspection port and pumped out the "stuff" on the bottom. I am very fussy about the quality of the water, and the taste (I cook with filtered water, as well).

I am now lobbying for a watermaker. It goes against the grain, but since we have to run the generator every day or so when at anchor, a watermaker would be the right system for this boat. There are tradeoffs with everything, I guess.

Here's a photo of our pre-filter, alongside the filter cartridge when new.
http://www.fototime.com/3CB90266AA12713/standard.jpg

[Catalina Kids]

Thanks JeanneP

[JeanneP]

I forgot to mention that the picture of that filter was taken after only one filling of our tanks (75 gallons)(!!). Our neighbors at the marina discovered after a year of putting the water into their tanks without pre-filtering that they had about an inch of "mud" on the bottom of the tank (!). Costa Rica (Golfito) spring water had the same effect on tanks, and everybody thought the water was crystal clear.

[stykman]

have read in a couple of places that adding chlorine to aluminum tanks is bad, something about the chemical interaction between the chlorine and the aluminum. anyone have an opinion about that? also, when using a watermaker, what kind of tankage (30 gal, 50 gal, 70 gal?) do most consider adequate?

thanks,
scott and cheryl
s/v celestial sea
kodiak, ak

[Patrick]

I've sailed all over the world professionally for the last 30 years. On my own boat, I use a Teledyne residential water filter hard piped to my water tank because the filters are easy to find and inexpensive. I have filled my water tanks and many other people's tanks all over the world with local water. I did receive discolored water (dissolved solids) a few times. The only consequence is an inexpensive filter change. Regardless of where you get water from, there will be some amount of solids in it, whether visible or not. They will accumulate in the tank and it will need to be cleaned out periodically. I use Clorox bleach 1 tablespoon to 25 gallons everywhere, including the US, to assist in purification. I filter the water with an Everpure Pro Series 1500 under counter filter before using it. There is no chlorine taste or odor. Even rain water tastes pure after passing through the filters. Buying bottled water, which is available anywhere tourists are, is a dead end road, and no solution to your water needs. You need to either get a bigger water tank or buy a water maker. A water maker is freedom from dependency and unnecessary port calls, just to fill your water tanks. Of course, those same port calls are my favorite part of cruising… Regardless, I would have no reservation with filling my water tank in port, because RO membranes are expensive. However, water makers work better when you use them all the time, not just occasionally. I also recommend never using a water maker in port or in areas where the water is visibly cloudy. I hope your water tank is bigger than 20 gallons because water goes fast underway, especially if you're not used to conserving it. I would take bottled water on your first trip so you can convince yourself how fast it goes and how much waste it generates. I believe that the bottled water you buy in other countries is filtered as good as in the US, but I have no fact to back that up. It all tastes the same to me, but I drink filtered tap water at home in the US, so I'm not really a water connoisseur. Go cruising and don't think about this too much. When you are getting close to running out of water, stop in somewhere and get some. People have been doing it for hundreds of years. If you are planning on serious cruising, start saving your money for a water maker because it provides freedom from frequent port calls, which also costs money. Ironically, I've never been sick from water borne diseases and I eat and drink whatever is local everywhere I go. You may have some minor initial travel digestive trauma at first, but I believe your body gets used to the diversity and things go back to normal. I would be more concerned with washing your hands. Don't worry, you'll get used to the taste of cruising, and water issues will become a matter of habit like filling up the gas tank of your car. The more time you spend out of the US, you'll find out how much unnecessary crap we Americans have become accustomed to. Go sailing!

[starpathtj1]

I wouldn't worry too much about the watermaker. I have been in Mexico aboard Star Path for over three years, and have been just fine without. I would recommend that for the sake of economy that you stock up on whatever bottles fit your lockers the best, and then buy the five or ten liter bottles of purified water that are available everywhere, then fill your bottles from that. You have to get into some REALLY remote places to not have access to bottled water. It's hard for me to remember anywhere that there wasn't some available. Any "Agua Purificada" with a seal on it is tasty and safe.
Don't worry, have a great cruise.

TJ

[Catalina Kids]

Thanks TJ

[mike brown]

We have been cruising in Mexico for the last two years and have no problem getting a lot of U.S. brands. They are normally more expensive then local brands. There are Costcos and Walmarts in a number of places. We have been on the West coast and Baja area for the two years. Bottled water is no problem, as a matter of fact, most Mexicans we know also drink bottled water. In most marinas you can have 5 gal bottles of water delivered.

I agree that trying the local brands can be fun and sometimes a little suprising. Just get on the radio in any anchorage and there will be a number of people that will give you advice on where to get just about anything you need. Just remember that everything takes a day to get or do and relax your in margaritaville.

Have fun and go slow

mike
s/v Antipodes

[rserrano]

Ahh for God's sake. Where do you think you are going....Timbuctu?

Wherever you find people, you will find food. And water. If you are going to go cruising you had better get past the bottled water thing. Any time you eat out you will have a salad... rinsed in local water, dishes washed in local water, ice in your drinks made from local water and all foods cooked...in local water.

The biggest pain in the **Badword** I ever ran into while cruising was a couple in Venezuela (actually only 'she' was the problem)who insisted on buying only bottled water for 'everything'. The poor shmuck of a husband had to cart litterally hundreds of individual gallon jugs of wate to fill their tanks everywhere they went.

Water makers are okay I suppose but what are you going to do when it breaks down?....they always breakdown...everything breaks down. What could be worse than being stuck in the middle of nowhere with and have to drink the local water?...Being stuck in the middle of nowhere and having to drink the local water....without ever having your body built up immunity to the various grades and quality of 'local' water where you have been traveling.

Unless you have some rare disease that requires nothing but the purest of water entering your body, you should break yourself into the acceptance of drinking local water....wherever you go.

You can have an idea of the kind of marinas infrastructure, services and other people experiences cruising Mexico in this site http://www.latitudemexico.com

Hope this helps :wink: